>> predictions, go, toby. >> i think that dow jones industrials is up 20% by the end of the year. >> brenda: stephen bull or bear. >> bear. >> brenda: your prediction. >> southwest will be up 25% in a year. >> brenda: jonas bull or bear. >> no he. >> brenda: gary b, your prediction. >> linkedin is the new facebook, i think it hits $200 by the end of the year. >> brenda: jim, what do you think, bull or bear. >> bear, rich valuation. i like zxj and currency on it. >> brenda: gary b what, do you think on that. >> bear. >> brenda: that's clear. jonas your prediction. >> health study about benefits of red wine and dark chocolate reaffirmed this week, good for the economy that's fueled by both of those, france. and france up-- >> you better respond to that, but toby. >> la bear, la bear. >> brenda: i don't agree, i called you dr. jonas and i like

that, that works for me. >> and my new diet. >> brenda: oh, i like it. coming up, cornerstone of the cost of freedom, cavuto on business. stay tuned. >> . >> neil: well, your tax refund may have to wait, but the government is not waiting one nano second for the present's health care law. i'm charles payne in for neil cavuto, whether it's the cliff or the sequester cuts to blame, more taxpayers are told they'll have to wait for their money, but a new report shows the irs is going full steam ahead, collecting the new health care. and another double standard. and ben stein, dagen mcdowell, charlie gasperino and adam lashinsky. dagen, sequester hypocrisy? >> of course it is, scare the bejesus out of people and make people think at least they're not going to get their tax refund, but again, the money needs to keep rolling in to pay for the president's health care

law and we have no idea yet how much this is going to hit the american people because this year, don't forget, on higher income americans, you have medicare payroll tax hikes, investment income tax hike, a hike in the threshold where you can deduct your medical expenses, you have the medical devices tax, that's just this year. >> that's this year and gary k, with all of that stuff they're not going to wait a nano second to collect their money, but people watching the show wondering what the heck, where is my tax rehe fund? >> i think you have a situation where they're trying to cause as much pain as possible to show you, hey, i told you so, the sequester was bad. look, we went this week where they actually shut down the tours of the white house that only costs $17,000 a week. trying to make a point, prove a point and that's to go down the republicans throat to make them look bad and we end up losing in the end. >> ben, what do you think?

where do you stand on this? >> i think universal health care is a moral requirement, mr. nixon ordered that we tried to get it through and senator kennedy killed it. but that being said, look, government works by the votes of the people. the people elected a democratic congress, big mistake, so we got obamacare, we elected a democratic president, big mistake so we have obamacare. now we have to live by the law. if the law requires that we pay these taxes the law requires that we don't fail to obey them or we go to prison. we need to rally ourselves and get off our back sides enough to elect a republican president and then we'll get it fixed maybe. >> hopefully, maybe. charlie, here is the thing though, the government always gets theirs. there are people that have worked out, took maoney out of y check and i'm waiting to get it back. >> i think it's great, two stories. >> what part is great. >> i think it's great that people are paying higher taxes for this thing and they should know it doesn't come for free.

you're going to elect barack obama for your president and elect a democratic congress and pass through this nonsense, you're going to have to pay for it and you get what you pay for. what's not great is how the media is handling this and the notion the president-- when you say "they", the president is pulling out the stops in a political way saying no more tours. by the way, republicans were going to give him the authority to pick and choose exactly how to make these cuts. you don't have to do it at once. >> he said no thank you. >> he said no thank you, and this is really, it's shameful behavior. >> and speaking of shameful, adam, let's talk about the health care law. >> i'm not shameful, charles. >> and all of our president, right, 20 new taxes, 400 billion in taxes over ten years, oh, by the way, 35% of these taxes are hitting families that are making under $250,000 a year. adam, the floor is yours. >> well, thank you, charles. (laughter) first of all, i think that everybody who is banking on

getting a big tax refund ought to go into their withholding and stop withholding so much. the goal is to neither have to pay a tax-- >> come on, now, come on. >> it's just a suggestion. >> now you sound like my frugal uncle who steals toilet paper from the restaurant. >> and having said that, i assume that paying-- issuing refunds is a manpower issue and that's what the of administration is-- talking about how absurd that is. the president is cutti back on the manpower to give refunds? >> i mean, i'm giving them the benefit of the doubt that it takes people to process these things. it does not take people to enact the taxes that were legislated with the health care law, i mean, that sort of looks like on-- >> let's be reporters here, you and i are reporters and put on our conspiratorial hats. >> you don't think that he's

doing something screwing people that have tax he refunds and this is the-- >> i think it's shameful, it should be a high priority of the government to pay tax refunds on a timely fashion, charles. >> oh, my gosh, they have beaten you into submission. >> of course they could. (laughter) >> hold on one second, but, ben-- >> that's why, he's getting a tax he refund. >> ben, there are serious economic consequences to the health care law. sequestration aside we know this is somewhat gimmicky designed to make the g.o.p. look bad and i think it's back firing big time on the president with respect to the polls so far, but all of this points to a disastrous law that's only going to get worse in my mind. >> i don't know that it's going to be disastrous, it's going to be a mess in the doctor's office, a mess in hospitals, a mess if you want to get cured of anything, but. >> pretty good. >> and that's the way. >> let's go, obamacare. >> in every other respect it

will be fine. >> i want to take issue with something that you said though. you said that we need to pay for this and we need to fund this. >> right. >> but a third of people. >> tough love. >> a third of people of middle income america are going to get hit with this new tax. >> good. >> on. >> good on their good health care plans? which flies in the face of what the president said? >> good. >> what do you mean good? >> you get what you pay for. >> charlie thinks it's good because it teaches americans a lesson? >> and people are not getting something new, not getting a new benefit. >> they voted for obama and for the democrats. >> not everybody is going to get hit with the taxes voted for the president. >> and the president won pretty handily on this agenda. >> the irs now is now charged with overseeing, 47 new taxes and/or regulation a as i walk through them and read them, i don't think einstein and steven hawking can figure out some of them.

as i look at it, this has come down to one thing, this is one big gigantic tax and i don't think anybody in their right mind knows what the outcome's going to be and what the cost is going to be, but we do have precedence that every major government program has turned into one big gigantic blob and we've ended up paying it ourselves. >> they talk about economic benefits. hey, this is nothing to do with economics and we have the health care and-- i disagree, charlie gasperino hit the nail on the head and i agree with him completely though we're coming at it from different perspectives. >> you agree with totally different reasons. >> correct, this is about making a national priority, making a decision,n, we have decided we want to pay for this. >> but i guarantee you, guarantee you that nobody understands how hard they're going to get hit by the taxes and the quality of their health care. >> don't blame the president for

that. he ran on it the first time and the second time. >> no, no, you are saying that people don't know people-- nobody knew what was in the bill. >> and the thing is so complicated nobody knows. >> you're telling me the average american didn't understand this would ppen? >> they understand that, they don't understand a long-term implication, how this will alter health care in this country. >> and this was what a lot of people don't understand, that graphic that we had up. 35% of families making under 250,000. that was a promise, a line drawn in the sand throughout the entire campaign and anyone mang less than that, thought they were immune from all of the obama initiatives that are-- >> i don't care, any rational person who didn't think they'd get hit with higher taxes based on the president's safety of the agenda and talking about taxes up there, he never said he was going to raise the payroll tax, i'm telling you-- >> ben on that note, ben, listen, a lot of people are getting hit from in and listen, you've talked about the fact the taxes have to go up.

but a lot of people watching the show who voted for the president did not think they were going to get hit in the wallet, there's something wrong with that. >> there's something wrong with it and something wrong with the the idea of obamacare we didn't know what was in the bill when mrs. pelosi said we are going to have to wait until it's passed before we knew, and that's instant. >> real quick, gary k, is there any hope in sight, something we've got to keep learning about and paying for? >> there's no hope in sight. every program the government's done. every major program the government's done has grown and grown and grown and costs have gonene up and up and up and thas just the way it's going to be and until somebody steps up and gets serious about this and tries to stop some of it, we're in the soup, my friend. >> all right. after this, great discussion. big labor scores a big win against wal-mart. did american shoppers just lose big from this as well? my mother made the best toffee in the world.

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singlehandedly lowered cost for consumers and no, let's not build one. you're not going to have the workers. the construction workers, this is a loss for consumers all the way around in the city and tells you, i've got to use the words, they're dummies, people not allowing this to occur. >> i tell you this is remarkable. everywhere i've been to a wal-mart, people happy they have jobs and democratizes things and-- >> wal-mart is an incredibly great american institution, a genuine benefit. everyone who lives near a wal-mart gets the benefits of a lower prices as if they had a substantial pay raise. these are union goons out there demonstrating and holding up pickets that are paid i'm sure by some union, and wal-mart nationwide unionize jobs and grocery stores will disappear. it's very, very upsetting phenomenon, seeing new yorkers

to thrive in the benefits of wal-mart. >> it's disgusting, i'm a union guy, i'm-- >> i know, where are you coming from? turning your back on your union people. >> i will tell you if it weren't for unions people would-- more people would die of black lung disease in coal mines. >>, but fast forward to 2013. >> if you go to century 21 downtown where i use today work, this is unionized? >> this is a hit on wal-mart is what they're doing. when you go to the cozy shop around the corner-- >> this is the union against wal-mart. >> this is specific to wal-mart. when you're in retail in new york, those aren't like labor unions, people in the labor unions who are working there, so this is a scific thing for wal-mart, they're attacking wal-mart and trying to make a national case against wal-mart. let's be clear here, there are a lot of places in new york there aren't unions. it's not like there are unions in other retail-- this an attack on wal-mart. >> because wal-mart is the great white whale for consumers. >> how stupid it is, the

construction workers who build the wal-mart are union are ner he' out of a job. >> i don't think that the new york win in new york city would impact wal-mart nation wides. i don't think it helps the it at all. the unions are afraid wal-mart of moving into new york city because the people in the city will realize how awful the flipping supermarkets are, once they shop at wal-mart. >> and i think they're here, and i think it's national. >> i think it's national, too, adam, i'm not sure what the situation is in san francisco, but they're a little bit more elitist sometimes than new york city. >> yeah, you know, i'm not sure of my facts here, i don't think we have a wal-mart in san francisco, and i don't think it's a -- it's a labor issue necessarily. this is very similar to our last conversation, i mean, every-- i agree this is not a national issue, people in new york are-- >> and making the choice. >> wal-mart, they're making to make it-- >> let adam finish and it then we'll pile up on him.

go ahead, adam. >> i don't think, by the way, that this is particularly fair to wal-mart what is happening in new york city. having said that, i think the opposition to wal-mart is sincere. yes, it brings in the sheer economy scale. >> hold on, adam, when you say it's unfair to wal-mart, we're talking about, what about being unfair to people who live in these neighborhoods? you know the south bronx is the poorest congressional district in america, do you know how many people want a job and love to buy a flat screen tv. are you kidding me? >> but if you want to have a policy debate about this you'd have to be prepared to tell me exactly how many businesses nearby will go out of business-- >> adam. >> as a result. >> wal-mart, wal-mart-- last word fast, gary k. >> wal-mart is a job creating machine. to stop them from creating more jobs in a city that needs it is insane. and that's-- we've got to leave it there, guys. >> you can't prove that. >> i say what we can prove, for

every two mom and pop shop they may close down, a thousand jobs that would have been created. >> ma and pa need to get over it. >> get it on. >> the white house still telling us how all of those cuts will hurt. so why is it giving 250 million more tax dollars to people burning our flag? the forbes gang not happy about it at all. that's coming up at the top of the hour. first, read it and weep, a record jump for college tuition. is it time for the government to stop pumping money into schools with the spark miles card from capital one, bjorn earns unlimited rewas for his small business take theseags to room 12 please. [ garth ] bjors small busiss earns double miles

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>> talk about sticker shock. the average tuition at a public college jumping by the biggest amount ever last year. the same report pointing out it's happening as states cut funds to colleges. ben, you're pointing your finger at the money the federal government is dishing out to these colleges. >> and naturally they're putting money in subsidized students loans and naturally that money is going to be available for the colleges and universities to take and they will. so they're force feeding the colleges and universities. they'll take the money and run. >> gary k, on wall street we talk about this all the time. when we talk about bubbles it's hard to argue at a trillion dollars this might be the biggest one out there. >> well, ends up getting on this little wheel, as you get more money in tuition goes up.

when tuition goes up the government says we need to give more money because tuition has gone up and then it keeps going around and around and you end up in the cycle and never ending, and it costs too much for education. >> and it is a bubble. >> and adam, here is the thing at the end of the day right now though, parents are having to bear the brunt and to charlie's point and dagen's-- >> i haven't made a point yet. >> you nodded, but the point is. (laughter) some point maybe the taxpayers are going to have to pay for all of this. >> well, taxpayers actually are paying less, which was the point. states are cutting funding dramatically. i don't think there's a causal relationship here. >> you mean the federal government's not backing these loans? the federal government is not backing these loans and making it possible and the ones really behind all of this? >> no, it's making it possible, but i don't think they're pulling the strings behind the scenes. >> 90% of student loans were originated by the department of education and now we've got more than a third of young student

borrowers who are late on their payments. this is going to be a burden on the american people and we're saddling young people with debt and the government is behind it. >> we're saddling-- >> and don't forget jobs aren't plentiful. >> i remember when i had an opportunity, thank god to go to a graduate school and i picked the good one tha was the cheapest one. if you want to go to harvard and you know, major in fine arts and take out a $70,000 loan, good luck. >> good luck getting in, because you're a big dummy if you do that. >> and gary k, here is the thing it's enticing when the money is out there and you're a young person not necessarily thinking who is going to pay for it. >> bottom line, the government foots the bill. the student can't afford it and they're not paying it off and they can't get a job because the job market is no good. so you get into a vicious cycle and end up what, forgiveness? they forgive everybody else and that's going to end up happening. >> and guys, my thanks to

charlie and dagen. so you think this has been an impressive run for the market? these guys say you haven't seen anything yet.